[NoLimitssjca]

I think your wing clipping discussion is putting the cart before the horse. Wing clipping helps in reigning in a bird that flies off when he wants. Your guys haven't made it out of the cage yet.

Here's what I have experienced. Tiels feel safe in there territory. Period. When you encroach, they are territorial and defend their space. However, get them away from that space and the equation changes. I wouldn’t force them out, but I would remove them from their space while you work with them.

I have literally disassembled the cage while leaving them on the perch and reassembled the cage somewhere else. That way I don't "manhandle" the bird but accomplish getting them out.

The biggest key is that you don't get upset with them, just be a firm parront. They are frightened to come out, so bring out to them. If they head back to the cage, that's fine. But I think you'll find they act differently as soon as the cage is removed.

Oh, I did it because the cage needed cleaning and not all the birdies were interested in heading out. So I didn't force them, I just removed the cage for cleaning.

Tiels demand familiarity with their surroundings. Put a new toy in their cage they've never seen before and they look at you like you killed their best friend. Anything you introduce takes 2-3 days of being nearby to be accepted.

My point is, if they have been in their surroundings for a couple of weeks, you won't traumatize them by removing the cage. Quite the opposite. You will show them the world is right there for the asking. As soon as they are out of the cage, they will behave differently.

Good Luck!