So I'm pretty Sure Baby, our Amazon, has hit mating season...

[darkserenity]

I can't seem to find much info on it, but I think he may have hit it... We've still been working on getting him used to touch and such. I've been working with him every day, offering him (while he's on the playstand we keep in our room) the back of my arm, where he can't grab hold, and he normally nibbles lightly, only going slightly aggressive once in a while. He also, while he's nibbling, rubs his head sweetly again the back on my arm, as well.
Normally, if he goes to his slightly lower perch (it's like a step down), that is his way of telling me he wants attention. Also, lately he'd even seemed a little more affectionate. Three days ago, when I saw him do that, I offered him my arm and he actually maliciously bit me aggressively (I could tell her was actually trying to hurt me), and he left a large bruise. I was careful not to react or anything, but since then, he lunges at me whenever I'm near the perch (only me, I've been having my boyfriend change the lining and food and water and such, he's intimidated by him and stay away), points his eyes a lot and fluffs, and this morning he was even making regurgitating noises and strutting when I was around. I haven't actually tried to touch him since then, since my arm hurts like hell... He's even been aggressive towards his toys and such.
Anyway, I don't know much about when they're in season, how long it lasts, what to do, etc. Should I stick to not having physical contact with him until he settles?
Advice, please. :)

[DeguMom]

Ah yes, Amazon aggression. That's what gives them their reputation, but in all honesty, they don't want to hurt anybody. I know you know that, but it sure does feel like they want to hurt you!

They are just reacting by instinct, and it's not something they reason out or think about - their instinct just makes them react in an animal way. That being said, it still doesn't stop the bleeding. Your best bet may be not having physical contact with him until mating season is over. That doesn't mean he needs to be stuck in his cage all mating season, it just requires some creative thinking.

I read a great idea for handling hormonal males on another website somewhere. You make a long perch out of a dowel. You cut off the top portion of a 2 liter bottle, and slide it onto the dowel, making a "shield" out of it to protect your hand. That way you can still transfer a bird from cage to playgym and back, without exposing your arm and hand to any biting beaks.

Ok, that's just one idea, I also have some articles to share with you. I hope they'll give you some good info, and maybe some good ideas. When I adopted my rescue BFA, I researched all this stuff, so hopefully this info will help you too!

What's Wrong With Amazons - Amazons - Joannie Doss

Amazon Parrots

Bird Behavior & Training

Amazon Parrot Behavior Revealed

How To Tame Your Wild Or Aggressive Biting Parrot

And you can check out the "Amazon" section of this site: Second Chance Birds health and behavior of cockatoos and parrot species.


I hope some of these links will have info that is relevant to you and Baby. Sometimes, once a Zon settles in and gets comfy, the problem behaviors start to show. Poor Baby, he has had such a rough start, and all he's ever known from humans is hurt and neglect. It took him many years to learn that, so it will take him a while to un-learn it too. But you and your boyfriend are the perfect people to help teach him that humans can be kind also!

Keep hanging in there, you're doing great! I can't believe what FAST progress he's made with you - already accepting your touch. That is a HUGE step, and at light speed too!

[darkserenity]

Unfortunately, I haven't been able to much interact with Baby since this incident... and look how long it's been. I can talk to him, but that's about it. He still seems aggressive towards me. He actually let's my boyfriend touch him slightly now, but not much...
The only time I can actually have contact with him outside of petting his feet is when I take him into the shower with me... I get in with him (standing, carefully) and he uses me as shelter, actually willingly getting close to me and such. Of course, the only way to get him to the shower is toweling him, since believe me, he won't stop touching his cage of his own volition.
Heck, I still can't get him to eat any fresh veggies at all, and rarely fruit outside of, for example, a grape.
I feel so discouraged and sad, especially when my bf and I visit the pet store and the birds there love to be touched and are affectionate as hell... while Baby never seeks our touch, really, and at best tolerates it.
I want to start working with him again... But I'm tired of trying to wing it. I do know that if I start working directly with him again, I may have to use gloves (I know this isn't recommended, but it's better than just not trying to work with him at all, right?), thin leather ones or something at least, because his bites HURT and I can't get my fear to go away, and I know this would help.
I don't just want a training book, but maybe video guides. He still doesn't even step up, though Lo (bf) has tried several times to encourage him to. For example, if I put a hand towards Baby, he's likely to try to bite it. If Logan does the same thing, going to put his finger to his chest, Baby will fall backwards on the perch, hanging on with his claws (basically getting away from the hand)
I've thought about birdtricks.com, because I seem to be referred to that place by many other bird places online. If I did, I'd do either his normal training kit or maybe this BirdTricks.com Products one.
All I know is any online help I've been able to find seems to be for birds who aren't rehabs with severe trust issues.
And I'm so frustrated and depressed because currently my pet is nothing more than an ornament I can talk to...

[Jwhear]

Please don't feel bad. I know it is discouraging and I feel for you. My Zon is very aggressive towards me but loves my partner. I walk by his cage and he attacks his toys and lunges, but will step up for my partner. He was on the kitchen floor the other day and I walked in from outside, he attacked my boot and I could feel his beak through the leather. I just talk to him and hope that once breeding season is over he will be less aggressive towards me. Just remember you are not the only one who can't handle their bird, but you must not give up. As for the veggies and fruit, just keep trying at some point he will try them. I started giving my zon birdie bread, or special fruit and grain pancakes with veggies. He will eat that and the other thing I did was give him beak appetite with veggies in it and he started eating them.

[darkserenity]

Problem is, since Logan works all the time, we agreed I'd do the majority of training and bonding and such.
I might try the towel thing...
I just know, Baby was meant to be primarily my bird and my responsibility.

[chapala]

It sounds like he's trying to let you know that he might not want the physical contact with you, at least right now. If you miss the body language, parrots will resort to biting to get their message across. I'd back off from the handling (trying to pet, etc.), and try working on teaching simple tricks using rewards (little bits of favorite food). Barbara Heidenreich has a magazine (Good Bird) and training dvds out, and also a Yahoo forum with some articles - all positive reinforcement based.

[darkserenity]

We've tried to teach him tricks with food (consistently). He just stretches towards the food and if we don't give it to him, ignores us.
He won't even say things we know he's capable of saying for it.
Little effer... lol.

[Newticus]

I'm first going to say that the advice article titled, "How To Tame Your Wild Or Aggressive Biting Parrot" is complete and utter bunk! Those methods are outdate and those theories of
parrot dominance and submission are now defunct.

As for the treats, why not just give it to him, otherwise, as you have observed he will get bored and ignor it.

Try starting at the beginning again.
Maybe when you walk by his cage, give him a treat, or a few friendly words. Leave the touching and holding for latter. You might also want to stop toweling him to bring him into the shower. I know it's nice for you cause he actually comes near and it nice while in the shower, but continually toweling him probably isn't building his trust. Maybe spritz him with a water bottle to give him a bath instead.
I'm not suggesting to not take him out of his cage, but maybe try a perch to get him to step up instead of your hand (keeps you away from getting bitten) Or let him come out on his own and play on top of his cage.

Most amazons LOVE food and it's a good way to work your way into their good graces. Find a food he REALLY likes, and only offer it when you are around. Eventually he should start being interested in you and get to know that your presence often results in tasty foods. Once you get to a point where he doesn't lean away when you are near, or tries to come near you, on his own choice (without being aggressive) then start to work on touching, holding and picking him up.

It could be that he is going through his hormonal period, which can start as early as 3-4 years in some amazons. If that is the case it should work it's way out after a couple of months. There are things you can do to lessen those breeding responses too. Make sure he is getting 10-12 hours of sleep every night (most parrot breed during the long days of summer) and cut back on lots of wet foods (parrot mash, or warm noodles etc). Also things like vit E (which is found in high quanities in almonds) starches and sugars can signal to a parrot that the season is high for breeding.

If it is not breeding, try and be patient, bahaviour problems do not go away over night. He needs consistance and love from you and your b/f.
There are some fantastic websites that go into detail about positive reinforcement. If you look on yahoo for a list called ParrotBAS or generally under parrot behaviour you will find a good resource for positive reinforcement techniques.
It sounds complicated and hard, but you may be stuck with Baby for a long time, it's worth the effort to help make a great relationship between you and your parrot.

Hope that helps a little
Melanie

[sodakat]

You could try clicker training... just the first step I mean, where you click then immediately give him a treat. Him taking a treat is what you want to accomplish, not him doing anything else. If you click, give him a treat, then praise him (he will be able to tell in your voice you are proud of him) and repeat after he has eaten each treat, you would be accomplishing something that would be both rewarding and non-threatening to him. After you do that for 10 minutes or so a day for about a week, you can move on to him targeting a stick for a treat: you offer him a small stick, like a chopstick or handle of a wooden spoon, he leans his beak towards the stick, you click/treat/praise. Or he actually touches the stick and you click/treat/praise. You will be so pleased and he will know you are excited for him, so will be happy. This may be enough for now, and will hopefully get some closeness back. I bought a couple clickers for 49 cents each at a novelty store, but you can find the real deal online or in some pet stores.

Kathy