George Foreman Grill - Teflon question?

[knpjdad]

I've been doing research on getting a Eclectus Parrot, and have read the warnings about Teflon items. I was wondering if even something like a george foreman grill should not be used in the same house, as a Parrot? I have a fairly large house, and was wondering if I could just put him upstairs, if we use the grill, or should we just not use ANY teflon products in the house?

Thanks for any information.

[svolk]

I believe that George Forman grills are also bad since they are non-stick (pretty much anything that is non-stick contains teflon). A lot of people say that they will not risk using teflon cookware at all, that the loss is too great to risk if something were to happen. There are some that will sometimes use these products, making sure that any birds are at least a few rooms from the kitchen and making sure that you don't overheat the pans/grill.

[knpjdad]

I was wondering the same thing about a deep fryer!?!?! It smokes a lot, and was wondering if I should even run it, if we get a bird.. I bet not!! Looks like we may need to re-think are cooking practices.

Thanks for the info!!

[Alyce Johnson]

No teflon!
My understanding is that it is deadly, period. Fumes are too hard to control, plus we humans cannot smell the teflon fumes.

And new teflon is supposed to be really bad. Someone on this board got a new toaster oven for Xmass - and it killed all of her birds. She is a vet tech and knew better than to let teflon overheat, too. Meaning even with knowledge & the best of intentions, you can get into big trouble - and your birds will die w/out warning.

Teflon destroys their lungs - they die a horrible quick death! It's awful. I wouldnt risk their lives, if I were you.

Birds are a huge lifestyle change, as you cannot safely use a number of cleaning products, pesticides in your yard (because they get on you and you "wear" them back indoors) - there are many many things like this that turn out to be dangerous. Someone else on this board recently lost their babies due to using a pesticide outdoors - the trace on their clothing was enough! I havent been on this board long and already I've read several of these horror stories - and the owners are just devastated to lose their birds.

And of course, birds also make it really hard to travel - just going away for a weekend means finding a qualified bird sitter - which is way harder than finding someone to feed the cats & walk the dog. We have had a lot of pets including quite a few "exotics" of various types. Birds are by far the most demanding pets we've ever had.

Having to change all our cookware to stainless was just a one time deal. That's like child proofing all the sockets when you have a baby. Do it once and you're done. That was the least of it.

But seriously, having a bird is like having a toddler in your home - it completely rearranges your lifestyle. And they dont grow up and start school either - it's like having a toddler in your home for life. You have to be constantly vigilant of every little thing. They are so fragile, and so very easy to kill. They are not easy pets to keep, for sure.

I say all this not to discourage you - the birds are the most wonderful & rewarding pets we've ever had, as well! But do be prepared - it turns out there arent very many "well, we'll just do this, and the bird will be fine" type of solutions with birds. We've been able to do lifestyle "work arounds" for all of our other exotic pets. But the birds have really made *us* change to meet their needs. You end up totally in love with them, so you dont mind. Or at least I dont mind.

But a lot of people do mind, which is why so many birds end up having to be rehomed from their original owners giving them up. They are incredibly demanding, which is something you should be really clear about with yourself from the start. They live a long time if we dont kill them off by accident or neglect, too, which means it's a really long term lifestyle change you're taking on.

Best to consider ahead of time whether everyone in the household is going to be OK giving up many cleaning products, scented products, pesticides (indoors and out), teflon, certain laundry products etc - the list is almost endless.

Personally, I'd love to have a G.Foreman grill too - But instead we had to give up our stove top grill, our waffle iron, our pancake griddle pan, the crepe maker, all of our bundt pans - I had several of the expensive beautiful ones that make huge showy cakes - an entire, almost new set of cookware - pots, pans, skillets - the works. You get the idea. And that was just the teflon products that had to go. That doesnt consider all the other things given or thrown away. (My mom and another friend who loves to cook really got gifted! Loads of stuff went away.)

So, again, not to discourage you, but do think it over. It turns out you pretty much just have to accomodate them, if you want to keep them alive.

[knpjdad]

Alyce: Thank you for your GREAT post!!


I can't decribe the emotions I have been going through trying to decide if I REALLY want a bird... Let me rephrase that... If I really am ready for a bird. Yes I want one, but I'm still taken back by all the changes. Maybe it not that much, but I think Alyce said it best. "They are so fragile, and so very easy to kill" I have 4 kids, 2 dogs, 4 cats, Haven't killed any of them but, but it seems you look at a Parrot wrong, and there dead..

Really having 2nd thoughts..

Thanks again for the great post!!

[svolk]

All of the changes still worry me, knjpdad. We still have 2 nonstick frying pans that hubby refuses to throw out. I will not use them anymore and will not buy any more nonstick cookware. When he uses them, I insist that he moves Jerry into the room furthest from the kitchen, closes the door, puts a towel under the door to help with fumes, and uses caution to not forget to turn the burner off. Our pans are a couple years old, but it still scares me. I am also concerned with cleaning products. I have many other animals and have greatly minimized my ammonia cleaning products due to the fish tanks, etc., but I'm always wondering if something I use (perfume, etc) is detrimental. I never use anything near Jerry or in his room, but the concern is still there.

[Lori L]

It is important to note that Teflon is a name brand the proper term is PTFE. See below:


WHAT IS Teflon ®?
Teflon ® is a registered trademark of DuPont and is used in relation to products manufactured with Dupont’s fluoropolymer resins.

What is PTFE?
PTFE stands for PolyTetraFluoroEthylene, which is the chemical term
for the polymer (CF2)n.

There are MANY things that contain PTFE that are not Teflon, hairdryers, heating pads, toasters etc.

[Alyce Johnson]

Just for the sake of comparison:

We've had snakes, lizards & frogs (several of which were rain forest natives and had to be kept constantly warm, were hard to feed, would only eat live if they would eat at all - etc.)
We've had up to 7 cats at a time in a small 1 bedrm apt.
We've had freshwater fish.
We currently have a 150 gal+ reef tank with salt water fish.

Of the above, the salt water tank was the hardest in terms of maintenance. I have to say that cleaning cages is easier than keeping 150 gals of water clean when you have a large eel in residence, within.

But in terms of being hard to keep healthy and alive - the birds are way more sensitive than the corals - and salt water reef tanks are not easy things to get right. Also, with the possible exception of a couple of types of really fragile reef fish, the birds are also way more fragile in general, in terms of there being a lot of things in a normal modern household that can harm them.

I think that's the hardest thing - it's not that they are inherently so fragile in their own environment - it's just that their specific needs (and their vulnerable areas - such as their respiratory system) make them less compatible with a modern house & lifestyle than many other pets. Even a gas stove is a real hazard.

Our lives have so many chemicals in them, you never really realize until you start needing to be so careful. Frankly, it's really hard to keep them safe - it's so easy to slip up! There have been some truly heartbreaking stories on this board, from people who knew the hazards and had tried to protect their birds. It scares me, because I'm so in love with mine, and I'm always worried something will go wrong.

And if you live in an apt as we do, you have to worry about your neighbors, too. We had to calk along the edges of our floor to keep cigarette smoke (and who knows what else) from coming up around the edges. The smell bothered us, but it was the birds (and the fear of burnt teflon, mainly) that motivated us to seal the edges. I'm looking forward to moving, actually, so my birds will be safer.

It's a lot to think about, and I'm glad you're really making sure you're ready, before you start in. I think that's wise - most of the rest of us probably started with a smaller "starter" bird, and got bit by the bug. And just had to reshuffle our lifestyles on short notice. So at least if you do decide you do want one, you can make the changes ahead of time, in a smart way, instead of in a panic.

Also do think about how much you want to stay home. My husband & I are scuba divers, and I havent gone diving in a long while now, in part because we cant take the birds on overnight dive trips (cant risk leaving them in the motel room). You end up staying home a lot more - it really is like having a small child, in that way.

They just need so much attention, and you cant easily include them in your daily affairs (they wont let you bring them into the supermarket for ex). So you have to spend "quality time" - and lots of it. They dont really give you a choice, because they will quickly (!) develop some very ear-catching bad behaviors, if you dont give them the attention they need.

I think in some ways, the difficulty of just leaving for the weekend has been the hardest change for us. Even with all the other pets, we could easily get friends to pet sit. But a macaw's beak is scary to most folks, and we havent had any enthusiasm about pet sitting the larger birds! It was OK when we just had the smaller ones - nobody was afraid of them.

But of course, there's also just so much you need your pet sitter (or worse, house sitter) to know, in order for them to care for the birds (or even just live around them) safely - it's hard to leave and feel safe about leaving a non-bird person in charge of them for any length of time at all.

So anyway, I think a lot depends on your own lifestyle. If you go away a lot, or value the freedom to do so, definitely think about a smaller bird - maybe a small flock of them to keep each other company, if you decide to get them at all. And also you have to think about your general lifestyle. If you or your partner like to try all the new gadgets and cleaning products (my personal weakness) it will be a lot harder to change your life around to accomodate the birds. if you're into all natural products and all organic foods, it will be a lot easier. A lot depends on who you are, basically. I myself was not exactly "Miss Organic USA". So I've had to change my habits a bit!

[knpjdad]

Thank you again for that most informative post!

My wife and I are both BAD "impulse" buyers, and that most stuff we just kind of go ....... Okay.... You want it? Yeah!! I want it!! Okay!! lets!! Well maybe, it's the $2000.00 investment... Or maybe I'm just getting older. But I really have done a lot searching and reading before doing this.

Another thought that I had last night as I was watching my 3 year and my 5 year holding this eclectus, is that if he were to bite there little finger, he could probably break their fingers or at least require stitches... Have you heard of anything like that happening?

On a side note?

I went the pet shop today to see Astro, (Male Eclectus) and he was much calmer today then last night, I think due to the fact I was the only one in there. But after I put him back up on top of his cage I tried to have him "step up" and he nailed me pretty good. I once again thought of the kids tiny little hands getting the same treatment.

I have owned a cockatiel, but that the biggest and only bird I've owned. Had her close to 10 years, before she died. She was a gift to me, so I have no clue how old she was.. But an Eclectus Parrot is in a WHOLE different league!

Thanks for all the replies!

[Monica]

We have the George Foreman Grill here, as well as an array of nonstick pans. I don't know if the pans contain teflon or not, as I was told that Teflon peels and these pans look great! But then again I wouldn't doubt it, even if I was told that they were not teflon coated! All I do know though is that most of them have the Kirkland Signature on them... (got like a 14 piece set or somethin) I think they are made out of Hard-Anodized Aluminum??? If so, then I'd think this could possibly cause a problem, no?

We live in a relatively small home, it's a double wide mobile (though it's not as long as others.. forgot the proper name for it...), and the door to the birds room is always kept closed. With that in mind, we've been able to use these pans, and the grill without any problems. We also have a toaster but I don't believe this contains teflon (from the looks of it... more like aluminum). With anything, it's using common sense. Some things can easily burn, but as long as you don't over-heat the stuff, and use ventilation, you may be able to use non-stick cookware without problems. We haven't had any (even though I know it only takes a moment for things to change!).