Spoiling question...

[Mothi]

I will have to say that Yazhi is the most active interactive bird I have ever had.

The thing with him is that he is not happy unless the doors of his cage are open. Is it okay to just have him out the entire time I am home (excluding night)? When I am gone, he stays in his cage. It seems to me he doesn't want to stay in there though when I am in my bedroom (which is where I spend most of my day if I am home). He cheerps to come out constantly is not content until he is out. Does he need to learn to deal with it? I don't know how well he deals with it when I am not home though. (Not like he has a choice.)

I am more used to dealing with dogs and their training. I know dogs and birds have different mentality and background so the training ideas aren't the same. My dogs are trained that they cannot insist or demand things from me. They may let me know in what I taught them to be a polite manner to tell me they want something and get my attention, but if I say no to their request they stop. They get everything they need and I try to spoil them on occasions, but not to the point of being rotten and a brat.

With a bird I know it is different so I hope some of you can give me advice on how to go about things. Yazhi used to scream to get attention, but that has stopped after I kept leaving the room when he did it and not returning until he stopped. Now when he is in his cage, he makes very insistent peeps. You can tell by his tone that he wants something and at times, demands it. For birds, is it okay to give into demands or is it best that you make everything your idea?

My dogs earn privaleges with proper behaviors, manners, etc. Do birds need to earn them to or do they have the right to things?

I guess what I am trying to ask is, should I insist he stays in his cage when he demands he comes out? I probably do need to buy him new toys for his cage though and maybe more interactive things to do. He does have a good ammount of room to move around in his cage as well, but he seems to really like his gym. Or am I thinking too much into this and should just let him be out when I am home and cage him when I am gone?

[gbird]

Baby is out of his cage, or in his cage with the door open when I am home. If I'm in the shower (without him) or in the bedroom taking a nap or something were I'll be away from his cage for a while, he is in his cage with the door closed. I'm very lucky that he loves his cage, and can entertain himself.

My problem with him is, that if he can't see me, he screams. Hates it when I'm on the phone.

I'm new to this bird thing as well. I hadn't thought about leaving the room when he screams.....maybe because thats when he screams...lol I have put him in his cage, and closed the door, and turned my back to him until he stops. I think birds have a mind of thier own.

I'm sure this was no help to you, but I have the same questions you do....so I shall wait for the experts replies...lol

[Mothi]

Yazhi used to do the whole screaming when he can't see me non stop. But after a week of not entering the room unless he was not screaming, he stopped it. He may let out one insistant call, but no more non stop screaming when I have to go to the kitchen or am heading out.

[gbird]

When I'm in the bathroom, I ignore him.....I used to yell, "I'm right here", but realized that was giving him what he wants, a reaction, so now I just don't react to him when he screams.

*sigh* These fids today, always testing you...lol

[Nelsbels]

Gabby, a BCC is also a screamer when I walk out of the room. I alway ignore her when she screams and she doesn't get let out of the cage unless she has been quiet for 15 minutes. Last week she screamed so much I ignored her and did not touch her for 24 hours. My husband did let her out and interacted with her during this time. She has been much better since I did this and only screams occassionally and for less than 10 seconds.
I sure hope it stays this way because she almost got moved to the spare bedroom where she would not be able to see me all the time.

[Valo's Moirana]

I guess there's good sides to both - leaving him in the cage and taking him out.
If you are gone all day, you certainly want to grant him the attention he deserves (ie. playtime, cuddle time, tricks, playgym or whatever). But I believe it's also good to keep him in his cage every now and then, so he realizes that the fact that you're home does not automatically mean out-of-cage time. So yes, I would keep him in his cage every now and then (!) despite him wanting to come out.
I generally ignore screatching... and after a while Valo gave up on that concept, realizing that it doesn't get him anywhere. He is fine in his cage if I'm in the room (and more and more if I'm in another room), but he sure prefers to come out and walk around with me - which is not always possible (ie cleaning a fish tank?! chief would take valo on any time one gulp, and valo would be gone).

wrt to open cage doors - I'd recommend against that. I believe that from a training and "peck-order-establishment" point of view the power over taking the bird out of the cage and returning it there is beneficial.

[Irish]

Beats the heckouttame--My goons come out of their cages about 9 am, stay out on perches 'til 1 pm, go back in for a nap if/while I take one (otherwise they stay out), and come back out for dinner and to play 'til bedtime at 8 pm. If I go somewhere, they go back into their cages while we're gone.

If I don't do it this way, and they see me up and about, they scream like banshees. I swear to Dog that Bob has the loudest "STEP UP!! HI BOB!!" on earth if I don't let him out. I don't think of it as spoiling. Macaws without aviaries can't possibly be happy in cages all day long if their human is in the same house with them, imho. Might as well have them happy when we're home, 'cause they sure as heck don't like it on the rare occasions that we're gone much of a day, and they have to stay inside their cages....... MAN, do we hear about it when we get home! LOL!

[Alyce Johnson]

I agree with Irish. It's not about "spoiling" them. These are creatures that are meant to fly over large distances in the course of each and every day. We clip their wings and cage them.

It's equivalent to cutting off both a human's legs, stuffing them in a wheelchair and then sticking them in a prison cell. Would it matter how large or well equipt your cell was, or would you still like to at least like to get out of your cell and into the "day room" recreation area? Remember, you're in that wheelchair for life, in our analogous situation!

The way to keep them quieter (and you'll never get birds to be quiet like a well trained cat or dog) but the way to keep things sane is to have a schedule and a routine and stick to it. After all, this whole "captivity" thing is totally alien to birds. So at least if they have a routine they're familiar with, their natural anxiety is somewhat reduced. Remember that in Nature, they're prey - they become other folks' lunch if they're not anxious and vigilent. So they "go off" whenever something new or unfamiliar happens - since it might be a threat to their survival. This is why familiarity and routine in your handling of them will make them calmer and make your life easier.

Also remember that conures are large flock birds. (like cockatoos) The only way I've found to get a conure to be quiet when it's owner leaves the room is to make sure it still has some of it's flock mates with it, when you leave. This means getting more than one conure, period. (and it has to be the same species, too) They are far less neurotic when kept in small groups rather than individually. They're also exponentially quiter that way - usually. (although they'll do a group sqwauk at sunrise and sunset, usually, which can be pretty loud)

You can "extinct" the behavior of screaming by ignoring it. But the behavior is a hardwired survival function - it serves to keep them alive in the wild. And they're way too close to their wild cousins - they're not domesticated as much as a dog or cat is. So really, trying to suppress a hard wired survival behavior is going to take time and be pretty hard on you both. Easier & smarter IMO to simply get them *bird* flock mates and stand outside the flock a bit yourself, and observe. They'll still let you handle them - conures are very social, so they won't be real likely to shut you out - especially if you have an odd # of conures and not just a pair. But that way, they won't go into survival panic mode when you disappear from the room.

When you're their only flock mate and you leave their sight, their instincts tell them you may have just been eaten by the local monkey. And that they may be the monkey's next snack! So they panic and start calling for you to see if you're still OK. You really can't blame them. Their instincts are telling them their own death may be about to sneak up on them!

You'd holler like heck too, if your all your instincts were screaming "Danger Will Robinson"!

[gbird]

So are we wrong to "own" them, if we can only afford to keep one? I agree with what you said, and see your point, but it makes me feel like I'm denying them real happiness.

edit: I in no way mean this to sound like I'm being sarcastic. I hope it doesn't come off that way. I'm genuinly curious if they are happy with only us.