The "Starter" bird?

[Irish]

My first bird was a sexually mature male Moluccan Cockatoo who thought I was his wife :-). He was the light and love of my life. Now, how's THAT for a "first bird"? LOL! No research, no clue what I was getting myself into. Just someone who said, when I admired their bird, "You want him? Take him! He's driving us crazy!". That M2 taught me an awful lot about birds, loving devotion, and forgiveness. Many years after his passing, I miss him dearly every day. I think almost any bird has the potential to be a good "first bird" in the right hands. The right person will find the intrinsic value in their feathered family, no matter what the pet store and the world thinks their monetary value is.

Thanks for bringing this old thread back to the top. I hadn't seen it before :-).

[svolk]

I have not seen this thread either, and I tend to agree with Irish. I think that birds in general are very complex and not for everyone. And every species has certain characteristics and qualities that are better suited for certain people than others.

The topic of smaller birds being "throw-away" birds very much upsets me, as most of you are probably aware. Also the fact that some people equate intelligence with size.

As far as budgies are concerned, I think they are often misunderstood. I think that people expect them to be cute and cuddly, as they look, but instead they get frightened little guys who turn to aggression when expected to be something they are not.

I am NOT saying that budgies are not cute and cuddly, I am saying that I believe they need to be approached and handled differently than what people assume. I have gotten to know the other budgie owners on this forum pretty well, and the consensus that I have come to is that budgies in general are VERY cautious little creatures - and at a mere 33 grams I would be pretty darn cautious as well! Therefore, I believe they require much more patience from the parront in general, and especially in the beginning stages - which is one reason among many that I believe that budgies are not well suited for children. I know many adults who do not possess any sort of patience!

A budgie's trust and acceptance does not come easily, it has to be EARNED.

The little guys require nearly the same things as the big guys - they do need attention, stimulating toys, and fresh foods. Sure everything is on a much smaller scale than a macaw, but from what I have learned here, the needs and requirements are the same. By nature, if kept in a flock, I do believe they are harder to keep tame because of their very strong bonding to the flock - they are, after all, flock creatures in the wild.

As far as intelligence goes, I absolutely believe that they stand alongside the big guys. They have complex minds that demonstrate a very acute sense of environment and a deep knowledge. I know that talking and mimicry does not always equate with intelligence, but Jerry currently is up to a word count of about 70 words and that is rapidly growing. The fact that he is beginning to speak in context IS a testament to his intelligence, however.

I do feel a duty to stick up for the smaller guys since I have seen first hand what they are capable of both intellectually and emotionally.

[littlecharlietoo]

I am a huge lover of smaller birds - the finches are near and dear to my heart. (Even smaller and more "throw away" than the budgies and 'tiels!) Even though they're not hand tame, I know each of the zebras we have by call, behavior and markings. Each has a name and I know each one's role in the flock. They're wonderful to watch and bring me endless joy. I could go on and on about them (and if a good topic on finchie behavior starts I will LOL) They see the vet when they're sick and we've cared for and treated a few through tumors, congestive heart failure and a congenital heart defect. We didn't balk at a single vet bill or think twice about taking them to the vet. Their lives are worth far more than their weight in gold - as is any life. It's very unfortunate that anyone would consider any life disposable.

Smaller birds are not throw away birds, but there is a huge difference between the needs of a budgie, 'teil or finch and the needs of a cockatoo, macaw or grey. The attention level, the mess making, the life span are all much different. More homes are able to provide care for the speices that are less demanding... that means more people are suited to these birds. When asked "what kind of bird should I start with" I normally recommend a 'teil or budgie. Not because they are less valuable, but because they are less demanding and more likely to give a good match. Honestly, I've never met a cockatiel that mutilates because it is unhappy, but I've met greys, amazons and cockatoos that do. So, while I do agree that they are worth just as much as the larger birds and deserved to be treasured in their own right, I don't think recommending them as a first bird is really a bad thing at all. They are wonderful birds and people can bond just as tightly to them as to any of the other parrot species... it just takes time, patience and trust... but then that's true of any parrot, isn't it?

[svolk]

Originally Posted by littlecharlietoo

Smaller birds are not throw away birds, but there is a huge difference between the needs of a budgie, 'teil or finch and the needs of a cockatoo, macaw or grey. The attention level, the mess making, the life span are all much different. More homes are able to provide care for the speices that are less demanding... that means more people are suited to these birds. When asked "what kind of bird should I start with" I normally recommend a 'teil or budgie. Not because they are less valuable, but because they are less demanding and more likely to give a good match. Honestly, I've never met a cockatiel that mutilates because it is unhappy, but I've met greys, amazons and cockatoos that do. So, while I do agree that they are worth just as much as the larger birds and deserved to be treasured in their own right, I don't think recommending them as a first bird is really a bad thing at all. They are wonderful birds and people can bond just as tightly to them as to any of the other parrot species... it just takes time, patience and trust... but then that's true of any parrot, isn't it?

I agree and disagree with some of your statements here. I agree that ALL parrots require time, patience, and trust - but I think this comes in a different form with budgies. I don't necessarily think they are less demanding than a larger parrot - I believe that it takes a GREAT deal of time and patience required to earn a budgie's trust. Of course I think there is a less physically demanding element to a small bird (in regards to handling and cleanup and such), but the emotional time investment is great. Quality time such as sitting next to the cage and reading to the bird when just beginning to establish a bond - that's not hard to do by any means, but how many people are willing to spend weeks and weeks in order to teach a simple step-up command or work towards getting a small bird to not be fearful of hands/humans? I think that more often than not, people have to resort to moving at the bird's pace which tends to be much slower because of the trust issue with small birds - and I think that this element leads to small birds NOT being a good match for most people.

[Sally]

Everyone has favorite parrots. They are all parrots no matter the size. My Parrotlet Chipper is small, wonderful, quiet and FUN! I love quiet birds. There is a bird for most people and that is good. I had a budgie years ago. She was also wonderful, sweet and quiet.

Starter to me means something easier to handle. As you learn more, I think you can get larger birds if you like. People should not get a big bird if they know very little. Any bird needs to be investigated before they are purchased.

Bird forums, magazines are SO great! I wish everyone with a bird would learn from forums etc.

[littlecharlietoo]

Originally Posted by svolk

I don't necessarily think they are less demanding than a larger parrot - I believe that it takes a GREAT deal of time and patience required to earn a budgie's trust... but how many people are willing to spend weeks and weeks in order to teach a simple step-up command or work towards getting a small bird to not be fearful of hands/humans? I think that more often than not, people have to resort to moving at the bird's pace which tends to be much slower because of the trust issue with small birds - and I think that this element leads to small birds NOT being a good match for most people.

I guess my post was a little off the original topic, so I'll keep it short.
Handtaming a budgie can definetly be a pain staking process and one that many people aren't willing to do, but I've met many very happy and spoiled "wild" budgies. A budgie can survive (and I would argue be happy) with a spacious cage, quality diet, variety of toys and **ambient** attention daily. Try that with a cockatoo... 'nuff said.

One thing I think most members can agree on is that these little ones are highly undervalued! The propensity for people to see "value" based on purchase price is something that disappoints me all the time. Every time I see a budgie being boxed up at our local petstores I say a little prayer that they will be going to a home where they are loved.

[The Outlaw]

Interesting thread revisited.


The reason that one would expect to have better luck bonding with a smaller parrot is that one would have MORE time to devote to them. Cleaning and cooking for big birds is very, very time consuming. I could always pick up the budgie cage and transport it to the bathtub. A good hand held shower head, and you're good to go.

In the case of the big birds, NOTHING fits in the tub. Even the playstands won't.

Consequently, a lot of time is devoted to creative ways to clean and maintain them. And, a bored macaw or too, for example will drive you out of your home. With a smaller bird, you simply move to a more sound proof area until you're ready to deal with them. There ARE no places in most homes to get out of earshot of a bored big bird.

I agree with Sarah, however, that equal time should be made for all birds. We need to interact with them if we intend to keep them user friendly, healthy and happy. Many people will own one little budgie or canary and are happy and totally fulfilled. That speaks volumes for what they bring. Charming and happy little companions who are affordable and manageable for most people, budgies, canaries, finches and tiels are great little pets.You probably won't have to make arrangements in your will or provide a trust fund for them.

However, much like large dogs/small dogs we are simply drawn to different kinds of birds. I prefer larger dogs and larger birds. I simply seem to like them more. However, I can certainly appreciate the gifts the little guys bring. I have never been afraid of a budgie, but I have been REAL frightened of an angry macaw or big too. They can hurt you and I've got the scars to prove it.

[GreetingCardReligion]

I don't believe in "starter birds".

I think that smaller birds are wonderful companions and that a bird species should be chosen based on the preferences of a person, their lifestyle, free time, and budget but should not be chosen based on experience.

Not everyone may agree with me on this but if a person desperately wants to own a blue and gold macaw, and have never owned a bird before, I do not think they should pick up a budgie. B&Gs may be much louder than budgies and more time consuming and expensive, but if THAT is what the person wants and can care for, I think that is what they should get.

Everyone should start out with their dream bird, and many people's dream birds are actually parakeets or cockatiels so this is in no way marginalizing them! The problem with starter birds is that they do live a long time and do require care and attention but many people have their sights focused elsewhere, on their dream bird, and will probably eventually get said dream bird and rehome the "starter" bird or maybe just give it less attention than it deserves.

This is not to say that everyone should run out and buy a macaw, or any other kind of bird - including a budgie! Thought and deliberation and research into the species, into the care and the noise and the space and the time required is a MUST before bringing any bird home, large or small. I'll bet some people who wanted a macaw might go for something smaller like a cockatiel after doing some research, and others won't. Either way the person is getting the bird they wanted and are informed about its needs.

Most people think they know what bird they want, and change their mind with a bit of research or meeting and bonding with a bird of a different species and I think that is great!

As long as someone is prepared to do the research, to give the proper diet and attention and to take their bird to an avian vet regularly - basically: Do it RIGHT - I think they should get the bird that is right for them. Budgies and cockatiels are not right for everyone.

I don't think a bird should be something to "move on" from, especially with their long lifespans! A bird is a companion, should be exactly who you want and who you can and want to care for, and I think things like "starter birds" marginalizes that idea and definantly marginalizes certain species of birds.

As far as birds for children, I have rather different opinions. I'm childfree and and wouldn't buy a bird for my child, if I hypothetically had one. Certainly all people are different and age is no factor in that, but if I were to have a pet in the household I would make it a family pet until the child were a teenager and willing/able/committed and informed on how to really care for the pet they wanted. Situations like the 11-year-old in the Emergency Response forum scare me. I would not buy someone who I didn't consider to have the maturity and reasoning on par with an adult an animal. I don't know about having family birds in the house with children, but it could be a great way for them to learn about birds without being directly responsible. If its a big bird or one that's not childfriendly, make it the parent's bird and wait until the child can fully interact and take ownership of an animal before buying it.

Actually, I contradict myself a bit because I do think that children can be given puppies and I've seen beautiful relationships with responsible chlidren growing up with their dogs but dogs don't have the issue of "starter" as parrots do so I think the issues are slightly different. I hope that makes sense.

[Tiki]

My feelings haven't changed since my last post in this thread last year. I really wish people would put more thought and research into their first purchase of a bird. What I found very enlightening, especially when visitng my Birdboard friends in the States was to spend time with their birds and see which species I "clicked" with. In my case, it was always the Quakers, Tiels, Conures and Caiques. I met one sweet little Princess Parrot who made me want one of my own, ended up with two!

I met lots of larger birds like Macaws, Amazons, Greys that were wonderful birds, some of them would let me hold them and the Hy in Orlando was just wonderful! Considering the price of these larger birds in Australia, it's not likely I will ever have one, they all start at $4000 for Greys up to $10,000 for a Scarlet Macaw, a Hy would easily be over $20,000.

I love Cockatoos, but my set up-all timber indoor aviary couldn't handle one, they would rip it apart in days. Plus I travel once or twice a year, don't think a Too would handle that too well, and they would also likely outlive me.

So I have had to do a practical analysis on what kinds of birds are best for me to have based on which species I "click" with, suit my lifestyle, get along with my existing birds and won't outlive me.

For someone who is looking to get their first bird, spend time with any friends who have birds, see how you get on with them. Visit breeders with multiple species and see what kind of bird chooses you. Try to figure out what your dream bird is from the start and if it is realistic to bring one into your life. If you want a Macaw or Cockatoo, can you accommodate them in large enough cages, keep them supplied with toys-they go through them very quickly. Do you have a plan for birds that will likely outlive you?

[RingneckedPrincess]

What a beautiful thread! I must have missed it.

Most of us here, I gather, do not believe in a 'starter' bird because even if it is a budgie it still requires care and attention that you would give a macaw. Now with that said, people still recommed the little guys because in 'theory' and a 'perfect' world they would be starter bird! If people would keep them and not throw them away when something bigger and better comes along, they make great first birds.

I had three budgies when I was ten years old. From them I learned a lot and I miss those guys so much. I went to tiels as the next 'step' up, I was given my Araby as a handfed guy. He ended up pairing up with a female (who was supposed to be a male *sighs*) and ended up with a few clutches. I had plently of help through that time and the babies owners still keep in contact with me about them.

I miss my little guys so much but I have 'bigger' birds now. I didn't intentionly set out saying I was going to get a macaw no matter what. Aggie fell in my hands by the grace of God. As did Bodi when he was alive, I rescued both of them from neglectful homes.

How someone can say that they can start out with a 'small' bird and then upgrade, like you would a car, is sad. Most of those 'starter' birds end up thrown away to a new home over and over for the newer, shiner model.

Dani