I have a question concerning a matter, can you all maybe help me here?

[birdfreak2]

I own a few small birds, one is a sun conure named kiwi. He was brought to me 8 mths. ago from a friend who her mom had given it to her. Anyway, she got in a bond and I took this conure into my home until she could provide a safe home for him. He was a nippy little guy when I got him,I did not think I would be able to handle him. Well mths. went by, and I finally did win this bird over and he loves me to death as I do for him as well. Her mom told me to keep him if I wanted to and that is what I have done. My friend stills think her mom can take back kiwi anytime she pleases, cause she still holds the papers. Neither my friend or her mom has gave me any money towards taken care of this bird, I have spent alot of money on all 5 birds. They have not helped me with any exspensives here or asked if kiwi needed anything. I gave her back her damn(sorry) cockateil back cause I wanted her off my back. But if you piss this girl off she will tell me her mom has the right to have him back. I believe I have provided a wonderful home for these birds, a lot of money towards them and not counting the $400.00 cage kiwi has now thanks to my husband. Kiwi is mine, he loves me, and he does not act good with others except my husband. What can I do about this, do I have a right to keep him? One way or the other kiwi is mine no matter what my rights are, I be damn if I'm going to cause him any stress by giving to people he no longer remembers. What does anyone here think about this matter, and what would you do in my case......?

[Lynjupiter]

Personally if she demanded for the bird back out of spite, I would present her with a bill. The bill would be for boarding of the bird at three dollars a day. I would tell her that if she did not pay the bill she could not have the bird. Three dollars a day is quite reasonable considering you gave it full room and board plus care. The bill would equal out to over seven hundred dollars for just the tiel. Plus the addtional 400 if she wants the cage to go with it and any money you spent on vet care. You provided her a service by boarding the bird and you should expect compensation which equals what other places would have charged her for boarding. You might lose a friend but she does not sound like much a friend to begin with. I am not a lawyer and have no idea of things legally but that is what I would do. Definetly don't give her any birds back until you find out your legal rights and have her sign a bill of sale giving Kiwi to you, or maybe her mom would give you a bill of sale?

If her mom told you to keep Kiwi then you should be able to keep Kiwi as payment for care of the other birds.
Lynda

Originally Posted by birdfreak2

I own a few small birds, one is a sun conure named kiwi. He was brought to me 8 mths. ago from a friend who her mom had given it to her. Anyway, she got in a bond and I took this conure into my home until she could provide a safe home for him. He was a nippy little guy when I got him,I did not think I would be able to handle him. Well mths. went by, and I finally did win this bird over and he loves me to death as I do for him as well. Her mom told me to keep him if I wanted to and that is what I have done. My friend stills think her mom can take back kiwi anytime she pleases, cause she still holds the papers. Neither my friend or her mom has gave me any money towards taken care of this bird, I have spent alot of money on all 5 birds. They have not helped me with any exspensives here or asked if kiwi needed anything. I gave her back her damn(sorry) cockateil back cause I wanted her off my back. But if you piss this girl off she will tell me her mom has the right to have him back. I believe I have provided a wonderful home for these birds, a lot of money towards them and not counting the $400.00 cage kiwi has now thanks to my husband. Kiwi is mine, he loves me, and he does not act good with others except my husband. What can I do about this, do I have a right to keep him? One way or the other kiwi is mine no matter what my rights are, I be damn if I'm going to cause him any stress by giving to people he no longer remembers. What does anyone here think about this matter, and what would you do in my case......?

[nidoster]

Hey I just wanted to say that if u kept the bird there would be no larceny because there was no trespasory taking. In other words she gave you the bird to begin with. Second of all there is a thing called the self help doctrine. This entitles someone to help themselves to any money that they are owed.(In certain circumstances) There fore if she asks for the bird you can present the bill adn keep the bird until the bill is paid for. :icon_smil
good luck
Nidoster

[SavvyMoon]

I strongly suggest you call this girl's mom and ask her point blank what the status is about taking this bird back into their home. For all you know, the girl is only talking out her Butt, and her mother has no intention of taking the sunnie back. SHE said you can keep it, so I wouldn't worry too much about what her daughter says about it.

HOWEVER, to be sure you know what's going on over there with them (the mom and daughter) and to make sure Mom knows what games daughter is playing.... tell her what the daughter has been saying to you about taking the bird back.
Then ask for the Mom to make a decision one way or the other immediately. It's not fair to you, nor the bird, to keep the possibility of returning the bird to them hanging over your heads.

If she says You can have the bird, ask her to please put it in writing that she is transferring ownership of the bird to you, so you can then register the bird with your state's appropriate agency. (Most states require that you register exotic birds each year and get a "permit" for them. It's like getting a yearly license for your dog or cat.)

If she won't make your ownership "legal" in some way, then tell her you will consider this bird as being "boarded" with you for the last 30 days (to give her a break) at a cost of say... $100 per month. Each month is paid on the 1st, so come Feb 1st she will owe you $200 and so on. If the unpaid bill totals the fair market value of the bird in a few more months (and it will), then you will consider the bird legally yours. Give her this 'contract' in writing and both of you sign it.

Force her to make a legal decision and get the daughter out
from between you two. At this point it's very unfair to you and to the bird to get more and more attached with the chance that they will yank that Sunnie out of your hands at any time. Either that bird is yours, or it's not. Can't be both...

Keep us posted!
Savvy*

[going_birdy]

Everyone here gave some great advice and I agree! If you refused to give the bird back and somehow this situation did go to court, I highly doubt any judge in their right mind would demand you give the bird back without her paying you for taking care of it, the cage, the toys, food, etc.
I would definitely call this lady right away and ask her point blank if she wants the bird back. Explain to her how much he has already bonded to you and that you think it would be in HIS best interest that he stays with you. Say you are willing to not ask for money for taking care of him in exchange of owning him. If she agrees, like the other poster said, get it in writing!!!
I am sure this situation will work out in your favor. It doesn't sound much like this bird has any sentimental value to this lady and the threat of charging her boarding fees I think will make her back down. And once again get any agreement of ownership in writing. You shouldn't have to live with the fear everyday that your beloved feathered friend might get taken away. In my eyes, you are 100% this bird's owner. You have taken him in, given him proper care, bought him accessories that you didn't have to buy, trained him, bonded with him and well basically spoiled him :icon_mrgr I am definitely with you on this one. I truly wish you the best of luck with this situation and hopefully everything will go according to plan. Keep us updated please!

[The Outlaw]

She is ONLY liable for food and board IF you decided on that arrangement from the first day. You MAY alter that now by saying either she signs the bird over to you, or you will start charging her board from this day forward. A contract has NOT yet been formed. Legally, its her bird.

You can't just go back and retro charge her for something she never agreed to. I suggest, however, that you do get a legal release for the bird or return it, lesson learned. There are PLENTY of sun conures in rescues all over the States needing immediate homes. They are hardly rare. I know you have formed a bond, but in essence, you are merely the babysitter as it now stands. I always have ANY boarder sign a clear contract anytime they leave a bird in my care. I also addresses who the bird should go to in the event of death.

I hope she simply gives you the bird, but I suspect there is already bad blood between you. Her other option, of course, is to sell it or give it to someone other than you.

THE OUTLAW

[Samm]

If I were you, I'd keep the bird...after all...they can't just walk into your house and take it, can they??

[nidoster]

LoL Ellie Mae, Holding this bird would not be extortion.

Nothing criminal has been done here. If she holds the bird until a payment that woud not be criminal. If you were to go to a hotel and not pay the bill the hotel is able to hold your luggage until the contract is met or payment has been made.Again, there is a thing called the self help doctrine which is used through out all common law states. (I am not sure if Delaware is common law or civil law) . yet either way this is a civil law matter and would have to be taken to civil court. But as far as I cna see the lawyer fees would out weigh the actual costs given up. either way I would just wait for her to make the first move. I really hope you get to keep the bird.
Nidoster

[The Outlaw]

Here is your last option. Why not simply make an offer for the bird? In court, birds are simply property with a value based on current market conditions in your area. I'd check out the ads on UpAtSix and find out what a re-home sunnie is selling for in your state.

You probably wouldn't have to surrender the bird in any event if she sues. You would, however, have to re-imburse her for the value of the bird. You sure you aren't just over-reacting? And, one more thing you may mention is that its due for its ANNUAL well-bird visit. Since they usually set us back $200 and up, that may be all that's necessary to secure the deal. Tell her you'd be glad to take the bird, but she MUST pay for the visit and recommended tests.

THE OUTLAW

[SunConure1]

really you don't have have a leg to stand on so to say.If you have no proof of you owning that bird there is no way a court will hand the bird to you unless you can prove that she didn't take good care of him or she signed him over to you. If you take this to court and she shows them papers stating that she owns that bird the judge will make you give the bird back.The cage you won't have to give to her cause you brought that but in law she owns that bird. All i can say is give her a call and simply ask if she wants the bird back if she says why just tell her the truth turn around and say your daughter said you wanted the bird back. If she says no you can keep him ask if she will transfer the ownership to you.