HELP HELP HELP w/my U2

[Nisi]

I have acquired a 7 yr. old male U2, Whodini, I have had him with us for approx. 8 months. He wants nothing to do with my husband, he doesn't bite him, he will fly away from him. I have two boys 11 & 8, he use to interact with them from time to time, he enjoyed cuddling with them & then he got on the floor & literally chase them out of the room trying to bite their feet. (He was in my lap at the time) My 8 yr. old was doing wonderful with him & then all of a sudden Whodini bit him on the back of his neck & now he wants nothing to do with him either.

I have heard alot of people say how much fun they have with their U2 playing, there is one at the store I buy my food from & he loves to swing or have you turn him upside down & he has a ball. Whodini will not do any of that, he freaks if you try to turn him upside down or over on his back, the only thing playful he will do is dance. The only thing he really likes to do is cuddle with me & now he is trying to mate with me, every time he is out, he stays on me, he will not stay on a perch so his time out has been minimal, I can't just sit down & hold him. I would love to make him more a part of the family, I work, so he was plucking at first but now I have a stock of toys to keep him entertained during the day, so when I am home I would love for him to stay out all the time until it is "night, night" time. I grew up with a cockatiel & he ruled the roost my whole family talked bird talk most of my life.
We loved it!!!! I don't know what to do with Whodini, he lived in an outdoor aviary with 6 other birds when we got him, he was attacking the other birds due to jealousy, the lady had no choice but to get rid of him. He is happier being the only bird, but how can I make him stop trying to mate with me & be more playful & get along with my children. I think he is jealous of the children, just like he was the other birds at his old home. He has never bitten me, & I have bathed him & fussed at him when he bit my 8 yr. old & I put him staright back in his cage & he never fought with me about it( he even hung his head like a child being scolded). So, I know he can be a sweet fellow if I can figure out how to make him get along with them. Sorry for the lengthy message, if I can't figure this out I may have to find him a new home, I can't expect my children to go hide in another room for him. I really don't want to do this, I know it will devastate him to move & I don't want to make him adapt to new owners again. Please help - Nisi.

[KimBear]

I recognize you from another board I work on, where I gave you the link to the very important cockatoo article that all cockatoo owners should read. Even though you may already have that link, here it is for the benefit of others: www.toolady.com/articles/'tooagression.htm

You're experiencing one of the biggest reasons people get rid of an adult cockatoo: They grow up and then things just seem to fall apart. The good news is that this doesn't have to be a permanent thing. Well, the growing up is permanent, but unruly, out-of-control behavior isn't.

Many of the problems owners of adult cockatoos face can be prevented through proper socialization and guidance when the bird is young. However, because young cockatoos are often so sweet and well-mannered most of the time, owners don't think to lay down a bunch of rules for a bird that doesn't seem to need them. Big mistake. It's a lot easier to establish structure and limits when a bird is young than it is to set them down later. I'm not talking about turning your home into a small military base and becoming a drill sergeant to your bird. Structure and guidance includes fun stuff, too. This is one reason I recommend that people start trick-training and other activities with their young birds so that as the bird gets older, he'll have a "vocabulary" of mental and physical exercises to help him direct his energy in ways that are appropriate.

Teaching tricks and games to a young bird isn't hard to do at all, but when a bird is older, it may take more than a couple of peanuts to get your cockatoo interested in doing anything that's not his idea. You may have to drum up a lot of imagination (and patience!) as you get a bit creative. Look for things your bird does like to do (you mentioned dancing) and try to build on that. Realize that getting him riled up could make him pretty reactive, so it might be better if it's just you and him, and if you're at all worried he'll bite you, he should probably sit on a perch where you can be at a comfortable distance. The idea is for him to just let GO!! and get as excited as he wants to in a controlled setting, where you stay encouraging but also calm and confident.

As to how to get him to ease off from mating with your hand, work on getting him to gradually turn his affections to something else, like a fuzzy toy. In time, he will probably be able to take care of this in his own cage and leave you out of it. The less you allow him to get you involved, the better.

Looking at the bigger picture, Whodini's daily life may need a bit of an overhaul in terms of what he does and when, and probably needs some retraining so that he learns to trust and respect the other members of the family. They may also need some retraining so they learn to trust the bird! It's often helpful to start from what I think of as "level one", where most of the interaction takes place while the bird is in the cage. This helps both parties get more comfortable with one another without the fear of an attack. Even if it means just sitting by the bird's cage while reading a book, that can help everyone learn to be calm around eachother.

Because your situation has reached a point at which getting rid of the bird has crossed your mind, you may benefit most from a consultation with a behavior professional. I'm available for phone consults, of course, but I"m not the only person out there who can help. But you will want to work with someone who can address the whole issue: How to help a mature cockatoo adapt to living with people so that everyone can be happy. There are several "sub issues": General care and environment assessment to make sure everything is A-OK on this front; exercise and activities to give your bird an outlet for his energy, both physical and mental; how each person responds to the bird and how their interactions can be improved; and also, since you're dealing with something that can be very emotionally upsetting, how to address the anxiety that's likely involved.

[Alyce Johnson]

I'm no expert at all about 'toos.
But here's what we did to work with my macaw who was having very similar issues.
Don't know if it will work with a 'too or not.

Berta was very possessive of me & was constantly trying to mate with me.
She regarded my husband as her rival & was very aggressive with him - always trying to lunge & bite him etc.
It probably didn't help that she's blind from an injury (abuse we think, probably inflicted by a male given her reaction to male voices). She would lunge for him whenever she heard his voice nearby.

We created various "neutral" spaces around the house - playstands where she could be outside her cage, but still "confined" to a specific spot, not ranging all over the house on the floor biting everything in her path. (Which is what she'd like to be doing! ) She is the most territorial on or in her cage. So getting her away from her cage helped her be less aggressive right away.

Getting her onto a playstand (and off of my person) helped the constant mating activity problem *a lot*. I was able to interact with her in a less intense & less intimate way, than when I had been holding her all the time.
(And she has since "made friends" with some favorite toys too, just as Kim Bear suggested.)

Having her on these different playstands allowed her to interact with my husband in the way described above by Kim Bear, where my husband would just be in the same room as the bird & that way they got more used to each other. At first only I could pick her up & move her from her cage to the playstands. But she enjoyed being out of her cage & on them a lot, so she gradually let my husband carry her to her desired destination, without trying to bite him anymore.

She will still lunge at her "great rival" if he comes too near her cage playtop. But she's Much better with him on "neutral" ground, now! Best of all he can pick her up when she's ranging around on the floor in "hunter killer" mode and put her back in a safe place. (Safer for her, since the floor has a lot of hazards!)

The key for us was to use hanging play stands that she cannot escape from. I highly recommend Wayne's bottlebrush gyms. They're the best things I ever bought for my birds. They're not totally "escape proof" as Nancy (aka "the outlaw") can attest. But they make it a lot harder for your bird to escape! However, we've also built our own stands out of things as diverse as grape vine salvaged from an old vineyard to a bamboo chair base from Goodwill. So you can also just be creative - it doesn't have to cost a fortune to give your bird a higher quality of life.

Also if your bird is flying away from people he doesn't prefer to interact with, he can probably fly/glide down off of a playstand, too. So I'd suggest a good solid clip. I hate to clip my birds. But in some cases, you have to do it in order to discourage them from getting themselves into trouble. Your bird could probably find a nice tasty electrical cord to chew on, if he was exploring on the floor, for example. So you probably want to take whatever steps are necessary to "tree" him. He will be far safer on his cage or a playstand, than on the floor! Also, when they're a little less mobile, they tend to be *a lot* more cooperative, oftentimes, too.

Now, I've heard that 'toos like to be on the floor. But maybe if he drops like a rock to the ground when he takes off from his cage, he will be somewhat discouraged from taking the leap? This is probably something you should ask a 'too expert about. But I doubt a good solid clip will make matters any worse, in any case.

There are a lot of other ways to "distract" your bird & make sure he has other things occupying his time, besides thoughts of Luv. foraging activities, toys, tricks, all of that are commonly recommended for all types of birds. And plain old exercise (which again probably requires a playstand of some type where he can really get himself a workout) is probably a really good idea too! Birds were meant to be physically active and busy.

Finally, since your bird was used to an aviary setting for a long time, I'd suggest finding a way for him to spend some time outdoors, or at least to get some sun & air. I've put playstands on my screened porch where they get the morning sun or in the kitchen windows for the same purpose. And lately there have been some very nice pics posted of outdoor aviaries made using dog kennel kits.

So it's probably workable somehow, if you really put your mind into how to give your bird a better quality of life. Perhaps he could only be outside when you're at home to supervise. But since you really want him to spend less time glued to your body, that's not such a bad thing - in fact, maybe he would be "enticed" to get off of you, if the option was time in an outdoor setting.

Just some thoughts & suggestions based on what has worked for us, with our very possessive heavily pair bonded bird. Hope this helps!

[homebird]

It seems Ok to post at this point .... Sorry to get in the way - I actually forgot which forum I was in

I read the article & the 2 responses & liked everything I heard. I would like to suggest reading the Mattie Sue Athan books on re-homed birds, maturity issues, and behavioural problems [I think I have read them all]. In one she talks about this very issue.

I think the main points are his background & age, his own personality, training/retraining, and your family's interaction/reactions.

I agreed heavily with the article when they talked about the eye contact & the talking. All animals respond to tone of voice - children's voices are high pitched & often full of energy - which your bird will misinterpret. Their body language is unskillful too & I’m sure that these 2 reasons alone cause certain animals to be deemed unsuitable for young children. If you explain this to your kids maybe they’ll be calmer around him & they’ll be less nervous.
(I have been very unsympathetic to my son when the cat bites him – saying that he’s set her up by being too rough or something – I’ve always emphasized his responsibility to not get her or any animal in trouble)

My experience: My Mom’s Tiel always hissed & even lunged at anyone who came near his cage & tried to bite hands that entered his cage. He’s not tame at all. But I’ve been working on his social skills. I always say hello & chat when I’m working on their cage. I ignore his hissing & give him his space by looking away. I even bob my head a lot – read that bird body language will foster confidence in you – it worked! edit - re: head bobbing - recently was pointed out that this is/can be interpreted as couring behaviour - perhaps because I don't use it all the time it hasn't had any bad effects.

This is a very big issue - you'll have to be diligent & it's a whole family kind of thing. As soon as you can safely do it I would add more socialization - people coming to say hi - that sort of thing. He & you will be happier if he’s more relaxed around others.
My friend's Jardin enjoys visiting her sister's Toos - maybe a bird club or another local enthusiast would be a nice diversion & something fun to do?
Let us know how it's going.
All the best

[KimBear]

Two points I'd like to add:

The first one, in which I add the italics....

"Now, I've heard that 'toos like to be on the floor. But maybe if he drops like a rock to the ground when he takes off from his cage, he will be somewhat discouraged from taking the leap? This is probably something you should ask a 'too expert about. But I doubt a good solid clip will make matters any worse, in any case."

Most cockatoos are excellent jumpers, and will lauch themselves several feet to get somewhere if they want to badly enough. Even with a major clip, they don't tend to drop like a rock--it almost seems as though their legs have springs in them to absorb the impact. I encourage a good wing clip mainly to keep them from flying around the house, since that's not a good idea in most people's situations.

To keep a cockatoo on a cage or playstand, it's best to train them to stay. This can be done much the way you train a dog, but there are some differences because sometimes parrots aren't eager to please the way many dogs are. I've done several consults going over the details about how to get a parrot, even a cockatoo, to stay where you put him for a reasonable amount of time. Unfortunately, a "reasonable" amount of time may end up being only 20 minutes or so, but it's sure beats constantly chasing your bird around every 5 minutes.

I strongly recommend owners do their best to keep their cockatoos off the floor, even if the bird hasn't yet developed a tendency to chase. Odds are it would just be a matter of time before the bird realizes how much power he can wield over bare feet.

The second point pertains to Homebird's comment about it being okay to post in this section. This is the cockatoo expert section and responses are limited to coming from me. Other members can post encouragement and support, but please keep it to a minimum. If too many people chime in with their two cents, then there's a risk of conflicting pieces of advice floating around, and that can get confusing for people.

And just a reminder--My responses are my best assumptions given the information that's been presented in the question. They won't be a complete evaluation or solution because those can really only come when I've actually talked to the person and learned more details. Most peope realize that an internet Q & A isn't meant to replace the help you'd get by doing a consultation with me or another behavior professional, but I think it's good to mention this once in a while.

[The Outlaw]

Thanks Kim and the other responders. It is perfectly fine for members to comment once the experts have rendered their opinions. The experts may, of course, make corrections and offer why they have done so. We like to encourage lots of free exchanges here. We all learn so much more when we do.

Frankly, Kim is our most active expert. She is always available within 24 hours and usually sooner. Many of the other experts take a few days to respond. And, for everyone's information, not all of the forums even have active experts. Hope this clears up any misunderstandings.

THE OUTLAW

[KimBear]

I'm sorry for appearing to have jumped at everyone for posting replies here. I've never objected to posts of support and encouragement once I've had a chance to address the issue. My original understanding of how the expert forums work was that it wasn't a general member discussion area, but instead was to be limited to replies from the expert on hand.

Please don't think I'm suggesting that no one else knows what they're doing. Back and forth input from other parrot owners is valuable and should be encouraged. I just thought this page was set up for one person to answer. I must have misunderstood what I was originally told when I first joined here way back when.

I apologize.

[birdscomefirst]

Hi,
I would like to echo some of the things that I've seen in these posts and have seen work while working with my two toos :-) I know that I tend to feel safer when Max (U2) is not on the floor. Although we play on the floor occasionally, we are more prone to working on various forms of training when he is either on my hand or on a stand.

I also lean toward the thought that the bonding of the bird to the "lady of the house" is a fair reason for the aggressive behaviors seen toward the other members of the household.

Is it possible that allowing the husband to be in contact with the too without his "lady" around might help the bird to understand that all people in the house are "equal", so to speak. I find that by allowing my birds, (toos and otherwise) to socialize with other people that this type of aggression seems not to be an issue.

Any thoughts??

Thanks,
Bill

[KimBear]

There's some debate as to whether or not a male cockatoo is literally considering his human female owner to be a surrogate mate. One would assume that the bird can tell the difference between himself and a mammal, but in the absence of a real mate, is that parrot just choosing to focus on whoever is the next best thing? I think parrots do realize people aren't birds and birds aren't people, but in some individuals, instincts are so strong that the bird is driven to behaviors we think are pretty strange and often downright annoying.

It is a good idea for other people in the home to be able to interact with their cockatoo, and whenever possible, should be involved in the bird's training. Not just the early training, but the ongoing stuff that has to occur throughout the bird's life. Sometimes people don't realize that the guidance, limits, structure, etc. (these terms can all go under the umbrella of training) has to be forever, not just while the bird is a baby. And it really should be consistant from one person to the next.

If there's a favorite person, certain types of interaction that other people have with the cockatoo may have to take place away from the favorite. Sometimes it's just so the bird will pay attention. Sometimes it's so the bird won't attack the "non-favorite".

Ideally, the parrot would respond to all people as being "equal". The use of the word "dominate" has fallen somewhat out of favor in parrot training because it can conjure up images of a person being overly aggressive or even mean to a bird. But the idea that the people in the home are higher in the pecking order (for lack of a better term) than the bird is still valid.

[birdscomefirst]

Hi,
I agree that the "surrogate mate" theories are questionable but in my experience, it does seem as though toos and other birds will still take on a role similar to that of a mate in nature with a favored person.

I've seen toos, conures, amazons and cockatiels become aggressive toward others when they are around their favored person. It doesnt seem to matter if a female bird is bonded to a male or female human, it doesnt seem to matter if a male bird is bonded to a male or female human either, I've seen them literally attack people who get too close to the person they are bonded with. When the favored person is out of sight, some of the aggression subsides.

While their may not be any empirical evidence to "surrogate mating", The bond developed between bird and human seems, in my opinion to be pretty strong so their could be some validity to the theory.

I've seen birds attempt to mate with their owners. I've seen birds stimulated to lay eggs for their owners. Then again, I've seen conures mate with toys that have picked out as a favorite.

I've seen birds that are fine with any female human while being aggressive toward human males and vice versa. I've worked as a mediator in some instances between male and female bird owners. Keeping the two humans in different places and carrying the bird back and forth between them myself. This seemed to lower the aggression level allowing both the human male and the human female to handle the bird.

Kim is 1,000,000% correct when she says that the "training" is always an ongoing process.

Thank's Kim!

Bill