Help Needed with my conure, no tail feathers left and started biting!

[KevinAndTerri]

Originally Posted by Jag

OK, found what I had read in a post from Jak43:

Putting them on the floor is the punishment as they really hate to be below everyone (think prey animal - that's what birds are you know - instinctively they are always concerned about something or someone swooping down or pouncing down on top of them. Being on the floor is quite unsettling.)


This was the cause of my reply about punishment... NOT anything that you have said, done, or that I had thought you had said or done, KevinandTerri.

Again, I am sorry about the misunderstanding.

small misunderstanding

we shall say no more on the subject then.


qucik update. day one in the big bird house!

I went up to hyde's cage, he came up to me and his feathers looked fluffy, so I tried to stroke him, and he let me, even moving his neck for so i could get just behind his ear.

Then i tried jykell. same result. Even outside the cage they seem relaxed.

:1 4:

I have also knoticed that hyde still pecks at his tail, but not as much as he use to (maybe because hes hardly got any left). does anyone know when they will grow back.

[Jag]

If he doesn't touch them again... probably several months. Rayne's were shredded when I brought her home. I've had her since the end of January, and she now has about 3-4 that are new and nice, and just as many still that are the old shredded ones. It's going to take some time, unfortunately. The good news is they look REALLY nice when they come back in!

[Jak43]

Originally Posted by NotEnoughTime

So... Yes - please - do some research. I recommend starting with The Rational Parrot - the whole website is well worth reading.

I've looked through the website. Can you tell me something about the person or people who put this together? The only name I can find is Buddha's in the lovely quote they/he/she put at the top.

[NotEnoughTime]

Originally Posted by Jak43

Can you tell me something about the person or people who put this together?

I have no clue who put The Rational Parrot together... But the information contained in the site contains most of the recommendations and essays that are in various papers on parrots such as:

Behavior Analysis and Parrot Learning, by S.G. Friedman, Steve Martin, and Bobbi Brinker as well as Aggressive Behavior in Pet Birds, Kenneth R. Welle and Andrew U. Luescher

that can be found in the Manual of Parrot Behavior.

The nice thing about the rationalparrot website is that it puts a whole bunch of information from various sources into a nice package that is well-presented and well written.

[Jak43]

Odd that someone or some group would put together a compilation of ideas and thoughts, post them on the web without telling us much about himself/herself/themselves. They do not reference any of the sources you indicated. In fact they don't reference any source anywhere with the exception of mentioning they attended a lecture by "Dr. Brian Speer (lots of letters after his name, co-wrote Birds for Dummies) hosted by Mickaboo." He/she/they do/does not identify himself/herself/themselves or indicate what education or training they may have to justify their putting this up. I just find it odd.

The only thing I can ascertain is that this person purchased his/her/their first parrot in 2003 and by 2006, when the last update on this web was made, they felt they had enough knowledge and experience to decide what was and what wasn't good for his/her/their parrot.

The books you do mention are of interest and I've started looking at the articles. I always prefer to go to the source when possible. As I'm certain you are aware there is a wealth of opinion (scientific and otherwise) out there.

[NotEnoughTime]

Originally Posted by Jak43

The books you do mention are of interest and I've started looking at the articles. I always prefer to go to the source when possible. As I'm certain you are aware there is a wealth of opinion (scientific and otherwise) out there.

Those are actually articles or papers taken from The Manual of Parrot Behaviour - about $120 here in Canada - but is pretty much the definitive reference on Parrots...

Here's a list of articles contained in it:
*********************************************
Classification and the Status of Wild Populations of Parrots
Dominique G. Homberger

Behavior of Wild Amazona and Rhynchopsitta Parrots, with Comparative Insights from Other Psittacines
Ernesto C. Enkerlin-Hoeflich, Noel F.R. Snyder, and James W. Wiley

Parrot Conservation, Trade, and Reintroduction
Charles A. Munn

Sensory Capacities of Parrots
Jennifer Graham, Timothy F. Wright, Robert J. Dooling, and Ruediger Korbel

Social Behavior of Psittacine Birds
Lynne M. Seibert

Captive Parrot Nutrition: Interactions with Anatomy, Physiology, and Behavior
Kevin David Matson and Elizabeth A. Koutsos

Comfort Behavior and Sleep
Laurie Bergman and Ulrike S. Reinisch

Parrot Reproductive Behavior, or Who Associates, Who Mates, and Who Cares?
Tracey R. Spoon

Nest Box Preferences
Scott George Martin and April Romagnano

Hand-Rearing: Behavioral Impacts and Implications for Captive Parrot Welfare
Rebecca Fox

Behavioral Development of Psittacine Companions: Neonates, Neophytes, and Fledglings
Phoebe Greene Linden with Andrew U. Luescher

Handler Attitude and Chick Development
Brenda Cramton

Grey Parrot Cognition and Communication
Irene M. Pepperberg

Behavior Analysis and Parrot Learning ** My personal favourite
S.G. Friedman, Steve Martin, and Bobbi Brinker

Behavior Classes in the Veterinary Hospital: Preventing Problems Before They Start
Kenneth R. Welle

Clinical Evaluation of Psittacine Behavioral Disorders
Kenneth R. Welle and Liz Wilson

Diagnostic Workup of Suspected Behavioral Problems
Susan E. Orosz

Aggressive Behavior in Pet Birds ** Another favourite
Kenneth R. Welle and Andrew U. Luescher

Parrot Vocalization
Laurie Bergman and Ulrike S. Reinisch

Parrots and Fear
Liz Wilson and Andrew U. Luescher

Problem Sexual Behaviors of Companion Parrots
Fern Van Sant

Mate Trauma
April Romagnano

Feather-Picking Disorder in Pet Birds
Lynne M. Seibert

Psittacine Behavioral Pharmacotherapy
Kenneth M. Martin

Behavior of Captive Psittacids in the Breeding Aviary
G. Heather Wilson

Housing and Management Considerations for Problem Prevention
Andrew U. Luescher and Liz Wilson

Captive Parrot Welfare
Cheryl Meehan and Joy Mench
******************************************

You can find some of these articles on the web, some in Google books (with the odd page missing) and for the rest you have to buy the Manual...

One problem I've had with "posting" personal information about myself on the web is the number of people that then try to find me... So I don't give very much information - first name and city pretty much - but that would not stop a dedicated person from finding out who I am... Especially since they also can find out my companion animals and so on from this forum...

There is something to be said for anonymity...

[Jak43]

Yes, I did find them when I opened The Manual of Parrot Behavior. Are you the author of the Rational Parrot?

[NotEnoughTime]

Originally Posted by Jak43

Yes, I did find them when I opened The Manual of Parrot Behavior. Are you the author of the Rational Parrot?

If I could write that well I'd be in another profession!!

There are too many tell-tale signs on that site... In Canada behaviour is spelled as I spell it, colour the same way... That site is written by someone from the USA it seems from the spelling and language use.

[Jak43]

Well thanks. Wish Keven and Terry would update us on how Jeckyll and Hyde are doing. I'll stop adding to this thread now. We'll probably meet up on other threads/posts along the way.

[jenseits]

Originally Posted by Jak43

Odd that someone or some group would put together a compilation of ideas and thoughts, post them on the web without telling us much about himself/herself/themselves.

I understand your point, but that sentence was unintentionally hilarious.

>99.9% of the web is people giving opionins without us knowing who they really are. Heck, I've posted way more than my own share of opinions here (and on my site) and do any of you know who I really am (with the exception of maybe 1 or 2 people)?

The problem when it comes to aviculture is that there is sooooo much bad info out there. A lot of us have done a ton of research, and when we come across a couple of gems that really make sense, that is supported by everything we've read and observed and studied, we don't hesitate to recommend it. Because what else is there? The "scientific" literature, even if it were up to date, is mostly inaccessible to the lay person.

If you want a quick, easy read that lays a common sense foundation, there are only a couple websites that I could recommend. Even if they aren't necessarily well sourced, they are still better than most of the (bad) info out there on the web.

I've had Stewie for only 2 years, and Mika only 1, and yes I do feel confident that I know what is and isn't good for both my birds... at least more so than the average person. Does that make me an expert? No. But does that mean I'm out of line for publishing my ideas on the web? At least I don't have an agenda other than trying to do the best for my birds and trying to help others do the same.

I know we've wandered a bit off topic at this point, and while it may seem like I'm disagreeing with some of what you say I think you actually bring up a very important point, which is: don't trust everything you read on the web. Even when it comes to "just" info on bird care, everyone ought to have a BS filter in place when they come across info that hasn't passed the sniff test yet.

Here's a post on the subject of false information about bird training from Barbara Heidenreich:
Good Bird Inc Parrot Training Talk: Warning! Bogus Blogs Target Parrot Owners ... Nothing is sacred, it seems, when someone could stand to make a buck off our ignorance.