Well this must be where I am supposed to say this...

[LtlWngdAngl]

ohhhh...can't wait 'till our resident cheesehead reads y'all's last few posts!

[Tiki]

OK, I don't know if this is a cultural thing Australia vs some kind of American subtlety in Smurfy's style of posting that I am not getting but it seems I am in the minority to agree with Miabella so here is the way I look at it:

I suppose I have to put my 2 cents in. Hope this doesn’t come too late-but remember the time difference. I wrote this on a Word doc and did copy-paste as I would never have been able to type all this on my lunch break. I am very familiar with and was a participant in all the threads that are being referenced here. Miabella came on with a sick baby cockatiel, desperate for advice. Joel and Nancy did their best to help her without seeing the bird. I had been in a similar situation back in January (pre-crash) and knew what she was going through. It is heart breaking to see a little bird you love possibly dying. I had the 2 day old chick in my office and Joel was talking me through how to keep him alive until I got off work and could get him to the vet. If I had known it was so serious, I would have just called in sick that day-but I had thought I could simply handfeed him on my breaks. I think there weren’t so many Birdboarders around at the time, the only other person who got involved was BJ who told me how to make a brooder out of a cooler (esky). Joel told me to use an aquarium but I don’t have one-I do have an esky though. I felt just as frightened and desperate as Miabella did last week. My story had a sad ending-I got the bird to the vet after work, was forced to wait over an hour (talk about lack of sympathy) while people with previous appointments (non-emergency) were served first. Then the nurse drained the crop, gave some injections and I took him home planning to spoon feed him (smuggling him in and out of the office)-which he had been accepting. He died about an hour after I got home. I cried for days afterwards-got no sympathy at work (thankfully I have a private office). The year before, I almost lost my job when I lost another tiel-Ariki to egg binding (on a Sunday-bad timing) and was depressed enough that it affected my work.

The point is that in the real world, you don’t get much sympathy from co-workers about pet crises, not everyone feels the way we do about animals/birds. My boss kept telling me to “snap out of it-it’s only a bird”. Not having practical experience like Joel and Nancy, I did want to at least reach out to Miabella emotionally and let her know she’s not alone, and someone else knows what she’s going through. Later in the thread, I tried to use my travel/internet expertise to help them in a practical way-trying to find a rendevous point for Joel to pick up Peanut from Miabella. We were all very impressed with how Joel was willing to not only go the extra mile-more like 300 extra miles to help this little bird and he deserved all the praise he got. However there was one point where Smurfy did get antagonistic: “Hmmm think about it, huh?” post. She came off to me as being a bit snotty. With all the stress Miabella was under-sick bird, kids getting to school, approaching hurricane, the last thing she needed was to be goaded like that, she gave Smurfy a verbal slap in the face and I thought it was deserved. She was not being supportive or helpful in any way-just adding to Miabella’s stress. The “gay” issue was part of another post that was active at the same time-Ellie Mae’s “I’m New” thread which has recently moved to the Lounge-Smurfy was somehow accusing Joel of being gay or suspecting her husband of being gay. He was forced to defend himself and say he’s not gay. I thought he handled it well. I really enjoy his sarcastic wit and racy sense of humour in his other posts on the Lounge (along with some other people’s BTW) and of course I like to play along too! Personally I could care less what people’s lifestyle choices are as long as they are good people. And the whole idea of a mother flaunting her own teenage daughters at a middle-aged man (same post) is in very poor taste to say the least. C’mon, folks, you don’t want us overseas members to believe everything we see on Jerry Springer is actually TRUE, do ya?

I don’t seriously think anyone is going to be leaving Birdboard. What we have here is an electronic case of a middle-aged woman pouting, foot stomping and throwing teddy bears into a corner. She has managed to get you all into a tizzy, got some attention and hopefully calmed down. Also, she’ll hopefully learn not to be so insensitive next time. I hope she locks up her computer so her kids don’t see what she writes about them-I don’t have kids but if my mother has done that to me when I was 16, I would have died! Smurfy-stay, go, do what you want; you are old enough to make up your own mind. But if you don’t want to be supportive to someone who is going through a crisis, just leave them alone. BTW, I have no issues with teddy bears so I hope this post doesn’t spark another round of the previous behaviour!

I do hope that Miabella sticks around. We all know that sooner or later another desperate pet owner who has gotten in over his/her head will log on begging for help. To you experts-Joel and Nancy it may be the hundredth time you have gone through this, but to that pet owner who doesn’t know the other 99 times it will be the first time and it will be scary as he**. You guys will be busy offering the best practical advice you can. But I think they will also need a bit of cyber hand-holding and hugs as well-no one wants to see a bird they love sick and dying and they are most likely not getting support at work-average people think “It’s just a bird”. I know what it feels like and now so does Miabella so we can be there to comfort and lend moral support to the next person who goes through this.

[The Outlaw]

I want to make this PERFECTLY clear: though I am flattered to be so considered, I AM NOT an expert. I have some expert friends who will usually help me out if I'm in a jam and I have a pretty impressive library of bird books. I do, however, have quite a few birds and God knows I'm actively involved with many, many more.

That's why I stated from square one that it wasn't my area of expertise. I must say, Heather, that for once you and I agree here. When the best advice you can get is go immediately to a vet, than I think you probably should do just that! God knows that neither Joel or I ever send anyone there unless we strongly feel its absolutely necessary. If you can't afford to vet your pets, then you shouldn't have pets. In most states, its ILLEGAL to allow a pet to suffer needlessly.That is what is called negligence.Cruelty is going out of your way to make it suffer.

We have to remember that at the end of the day, the bird's life is simply more important than anyone's feelings. After all, they will live to fight again.

THE OUTLAW

[Tiki]

Tritak-Sorry about the misunderstanding-what I meant American vs Australian is that some areas have colloquiallisms that might be understood by local people-but not by others even if they are all English speakers. We also have our local expressions that Americans would find hard to understand or possibly be offended by--"Bloody" seems to be a prime example. I notice that a majority of the people are from the south USA so it is possible that Smurfy was saying something that had a different meaning in a local slang sort of way that I wouldn't have picked up on. In other words, she might have been saying something that sounded bad in plain English but actually meant something nice. Because from where I sit and based on plain old English I can see how her remarks would be offensive.

I live 10,000 miles away from you all and thought I was in a good position to be an impartial commentator. I don't know either Smurfy or Miabella personally and am not likely to meet any Birdboarders in person given the distances away. Both of them seem to have joined Birdboard at roughly the same time in May. Obviously one has made a better impression on you all than the other. Based on recent posts, I recieved a better impression of the other party.

I do admire loyalty to ones friends, I also would defend my friends whether they were right or wrong against a third party-but I might also be doing an injustice to the third party. I just didn't want to see Miabella written off as a potential new friend. She learned a hard lesson, I don't think she will repeat her mistake of breeding while being unqualified to do so. I won't reapeat my mistake of doing the same thing back in Jan. But I am really glad I didn't get a similar treatment from someone like her when I was in my bird crisis. Aren't we supposed to be learning from each other about birds?

I just noticed that 5 relevant posts have been removed form the quoted thread so I am not going to pursue this topic any longer. People are no longer able to read what we are talking about.

[kvnband]

They were removed at the request of smurfy. It was her 'parting wish' so to speak. Wish she wouldn't leave, but she said she had made up her mind, and asked me to do it. I obliged.

[Three Feathers Aviaries]

I'm sure Ms Smurfy would have loved to have known how many people appreciated her on this board.

Unfourantely, her leaving will have minimal impact on any, well, human, characterisitcs on this, or any, board. But, that's just it, we're all just human.

I know that we're 'here' to talk about birds, but it's fun to hear what other people say and think. I think I know what Tiki was saying about the AU / US thing - we can have quite different senses of humour, and sometimes things get lost (or made up) in the translation!!

There is really no need to be nasty, there is enough times and places for that to happen everyday (ie, winging to the 'your on hold' music on the phone...!!)

The whole sick bird post was very emotional, and personal. I understand that the people involved decided to keep it as an open 'forum', rather then dealing with the details privately - as an eductaional tool and, lets face it, a guide to measure just how emotional and dedicated people on this board are.

Which is a good thing, but it's firey stuff, gotta be handled with care.

I like this board, but when it gets nasty, it hurts!!

[SavvyMoon]

Observations from afar:

I find it very ironic that acceptance of opinions here (in this situation) seem to be based on "seniority".
Funny, but my opinions are very often shut down and stomped on by a few people who have been here JUST as long as I have or less....

MsSmurfy has been on this board a grand total of 10 weeks or so, but many people act as if she was a God-send Founding Mother or something....sheesh.

She started off in her very FIRST post talking about how she's always looking for a "good" chat board... (apparently having been through many, and not going back. For one reason or another)
Her SECOND post on this board was arguing with someone who knew her from another board, and you can see all the resentment and ill feelings Smurfy dragged right along with her from there as well.

So while I don't actually SEE what all the fuss was about with Mirabella & why she got all pissy, (except that Smurfy's posts CAN be seen as weird run-on commentary and sarcasm because of the WAY she writes them....)
I DO see Smurfy's melodramatic, hair-tossing, foot stomping snit of an exit as not completely unexpected--
and probably a repeat performance from other boards as well.

The jumping on sides by others- (thereby MAKING it a "fight") -
and defending people with outlandish praise and undeserved accolades simply because they've been here a few weeks longer than someone else, is ridiculous.
Honestly, can someone show me more than one or two posts where Smurfy really DID offer real advice, and was not merely socializing and "cheerleading" others on?
Not that that's a BAD thing, mind you.... but come on, lets be real here.

As far as Three Feathers' comment about putting the bird down and out of its misery, I happen to AGREE. I've voiced that opinon before in other "very sick bird..." circumstances -- on this board and others.
And the outrage was as expected. (Gee, where's MY seniority??)

Why can't people just be allowed to have different opinions around here, and if anyone wishes to question them regarding their opinions, so be it!
That's the way others (newbies and not) CAN learn to think for themselves and learn to question EVERYONE's thought process.
We don't all have to have The Party Line opinion about everything, do we??

And these are NOT accusations toward anyone SPECIFICALLY... if anyone takes this post personally, that's their choice. I said it wasn't personal, that's all I can do.

[SavvyMoon]

Sorry about the spelling errors, etc in the above post...

Only one cuppa coffee this morning, so far. :oops:

Savvy*

[SavvyMoon]

Originally Posted by Tritak

*
Ok so here is my one and only main point- dont come on an open forum and ask a question if you dont expect to get some answers that you wont like a bit.

AMEN!

[The Outlaw]

I'll second that!

THE OUTLAW